On April 10, 2024, Orenthal James Simpson (OJ) died after dealing with cancer. His achievements in life, Hiesman, NFL, TV, film, all took a backseat as the world watched in horror as be was being charged with the killing of his ex-wife and another man. His slow-speed chase even preempted the NBA Playoffs that year.
I can remember as I sat riveted watching the O.J. Simpson verdict unfold, the collective exhale of a nation grappling with race and justice was palpable. That moment, seared into the American consciousness, serves as the backdrop for our latest discussion at the Iron Table, where my brothers Keith, Danny, and Steve join me to dissect the complex legacy left by Simpson's acquittal. We navigate the tangle of emotions and societal ripples that emerged from a trial that became a watershed moment in our nation's history, with ramifications touching on everything from celebrity culture to the persistent disparities in the justice system.
There's an unspoken tension that weaves through the fabric of America, often erupting when we least expect it. This episode goes beyond the surface to examine the deep-seated notions of race and identity that influence our experiences and perceptions. From the courtroom to the streets, we scrutinize the constructs of black and white, considering how these artificial divisions shape our reality. We confront uncomfortable truths — like the circumstances, if any, where violence becomes justifiable — and wrestle with the implications for both men and women caught in the web of domestic unrest.
Finally, we turn the lens inward, reflecting on the personal and spiritual dimensions of conflict resolution within relationships. The conversation becomes intimate as we share our own insights on setting boundaries and the power of truth and accountability. It's a candid examination of where faith intersects with personal responsibility, and how the toughest challenges in our relationships can lead to profound growth. Join us for an episode that isn't just about sharing thoughts — it's about igniting a spark for change and understanding in the complex world we navigate together.
On April 10, 2024, Orenthal James Simpson (OJ) died after dealing with cancer. His achievements in life, Hiesman, NFL, TV, film, all took a backseat as the world watched in horror as be was being charged with the killing of his ex-wife and another man. His slow-speed chase even preempted the NBA Playoffs that year.
I can remember as I sat riveted watching the O.J. Simpson verdict unfold, the collective exhale of a nation grappling with race and justice was palpable. That moment, seared into the American consciousness, serves as the backdrop for our latest discussion at the Iron Table, where my brothers Keith, Danny, and Steve join me to dissect the complex legacy left by Simpson's acquittal. We navigate the tangle of emotions and societal ripples that emerged from a trial that became a watershed moment in our nation's history, with ramifications touching on everything from celebrity culture to the persistent disparities in the justice system.
There's an unspoken tension that weaves through the fabric of America, often erupting when we least expect it. This episode goes beyond the surface to examine the deep-seated notions of race and identity that influence our experiences and perceptions. From the courtroom to the streets, we scrutinize the constructs of black and white, considering how these artificial divisions shape our reality. We confront uncomfortable truths — like the circumstances, if any, where violence becomes justifiable — and wrestle with the implications for both men and women caught in the web of domestic unrest.
Finally, we turn the lens inward, reflecting on the personal and spiritual dimensions of conflict resolution within relationships. The conversation becomes intimate as we share our own insights on setting boundaries and the power of truth and accountability. It's a candid examination of where faith intersects with personal responsibility, and how the toughest challenges in our relationships can lead to profound growth. Join us for an episode that isn't just about sharing thoughts — it's about igniting a spark for change and understanding in the complex world we navigate together.
where iron sharpens iron, those should men sharpen men. I am your host, bryant, goddine, and I'm joined by my brothers Keith Danny and Steve. We're your waiters, serving you accountability and truth. We now bring you to our program already in progress. All right, welcome to the Iron Table. Iron Sharpens Iron, so should men sharpen men. I am your host, bryant, and I'm joined at a table by my brothers, keith Danny and Steve. Today we are it's what is it? April 14th, one day before tax day, so hopefully everyone, by the time they heard this, have submitted their taxes. If not, hopefully. You asked for an extension, but today I wanted to bring to the table.
Speaker 1:Recently we lost a brother. You know, lost someone that probably was influential. We all remember what happened OJ Simpson. He passed away I think it was like two or three days ago Cancer. But he will live in infamy Back in I think it was 94 that he was Guilty. I'm sorry, hey, hey, we all know he was in the slowest chase in America. I think he was watching basketball. It preempted. I think it was watching basketball. It was playoffs, nba.
Speaker 3:I think it was the finals.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and they stopped it. Well, I mean, it was still going, but TV channels had went and was chasing this white Bronco and there were people on the streets cheering him on because he was allegedly charged with murdering his then ex-wife, Nicole Brown Simpson. And was it Goldman Goodman?
Speaker 4:Ron Goldman.
Speaker 1:Ron Goldman, Thank you. And so we fast forward. The trial of the century. I mean, everyone was watching it and you had name brand people like the Kardashians, their father I think that's when he really, you know, we really found out about that family. And then, of course, Johnny Cochran, who had the famous line if it doesn't fit, you must acquit. And somehow, when they read the verdict of not guilty, I think, I was at Pine Forge.
Speaker 3:We stopped school.
Speaker 1:We were in.
Speaker 3:Fellowship Hall watching on the little TV we got out of school to watch it on the Fellowship Hall watching on the little TV. Yeah, we got out of school to watch it on the satellite TV.
Speaker 1:And it was interesting.
Speaker 2:Elementary when that happened, I think middle school.
Speaker 1:Okay, now you dated us. We all could have been in the same thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, trying to think of what it was, I distinctively remember the classroom cheering and the teacher putting her head down.
Speaker 1:Yes, and that's exactly.
Speaker 2:She put her head down and us, as kids, were cheering yeah, it.
Speaker 4:What was the makeup of the school? Black?
Speaker 1:Okay, and the teacher white okay. So, yeah, so that happened. Um, it wasn't all across the us, I mean, everyone was sharing. Um, every black or brown or individual that was a minority was sharing. For one time only, we saw how the system that which I would say nine times out of ten has been disparaging the disparaging 99999 it finally worked in our favor. Now would you say it worked though, Would you say it like I mean he made a face.
Speaker 1:But no, I'm saying it, it worked for for the first time at least to my recollection where you have an individual who maybe the masses was like, nah, it ain't no way he getting off, no way he's getting off, he, we hear, not guilty, and we're like whoa and I mean, yeah, we were excited, we were cheering. I think I went to what was it? What's that mall close to Pine Forge, Coventry?
Speaker 4:Coventry.
Speaker 1:I remember going to Coventry and I was walking behind ladies and I was like where did they left him off? He did it, he did it.
Speaker 3:He didn't do it. He just wrote a book that said, if I did it?
Speaker 1:Come on, now you get off and then you write a book, kind of poking the bear, saying you know, hey, if I did it, this is how I would do it, and it seemed eerily close to I was done. But was it OJ's, you know things? I mean LA, for me, lapd lost it, the whole prosecutors, they fumbled the ball. But were we upset? No, now I believe personally, and I said this back in the day, that OJ needed to thank Rodney King Absolutely, because if those four police officers didn't get off, there was no way we were owed one one one they call a flavor and foul yeah, we were owed.
Speaker 1:you know, get back and honestly and I was telling my wife this I said I wish we would have saved it. I wish we would have saved it for Bill. Well, you know I wish we would because if you think about the body of his work, you know you got the Cosby show. You got I know you're making a face you got the Cosby show, you got a different world. These were influential. I mean, it helped me decide to go to HBCU. Bill is out, I know he's out. One of those where I mean he was still found guilty on something and that just tarnished his legacy.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I guess First of all let me go back. You start off calling this man a brother. I'm going to be the antagonist in the room. Oj didn't necessarily think he was that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, didn't he say I'm not black, I'm OJ.
Speaker 4:Exactly. Okay, that's a direct quote of OJ. I let that one slide too, brian.
Speaker 1:No, I understand he said that, but still, when you look at him, do you not say brother, is he not a brother?
Speaker 4:No, I'm not condoning it.
Speaker 1:Let the iron table say that we don't condone what happened. We don't. We don't do any of, we don't do our lives growing up where we finally, where we saw a black man who had every right to be found guilty. He had a history of, of physical violence there had been some, some, I guess, police reports, police reports I mean just think of who it is and had everything to lose and somehow still did not serve jail time for that. Now, what he shouldn't have done afterwards was go with some people who had guns to try to get his stuff back. You know, and I mean you got out once. Don't think that that's going to happen again.
Speaker 4:I go sit his black behind down and he ended up in more trouble. So, listen, I'm frustrated. I was always frustrated with him. Because, again, we know, we know, we know.
Speaker 2:We all know.
Speaker 4:We know, we know, we all do, we know, but do I think we should have saved it? I think it needed to happen when it happened and I think that the truth coming out now like they're asking jurors verbatim did you guys plan this? And they're like, yep, we did Like. Again, I think it sucks when anybody hears that the justice system has been tampered with, but for our experience on this planet, in this life, that's how we see it. Every day we see people I've seen people incarcerated who did not do it and they know they didn't do it. It's just we need a body and we need and you're here, so you gotta go. So I think we need more than just one get out of jail free card.
Speaker 2:I think a lot of people are old, so was this a win, for black people need more than just one get out of jail free card. I think a lot of people are old. Was this a win for black people? Was this a win for rich people?
Speaker 1:Back in the 90s I would say Was it a win? We were happy, did we not feel better about ourselves?
Speaker 3:I think it's important to dissect that, though I think it's important to dissect that, though I think it's important to dissect why we were happy. We weren't necessarily happy that okay, somebody who like public sentiment is like, it's definitely sketchy at best. We, who had experienced the system being rigged against us for so long, finally got a chance to see, oh, wow, like what we've watched them do all these hundreds of years, we got one. It was like taking a ball from half court and just throwing it up, and just throwing it up and throwing it, and then one goes in and we're like yes, it's exciting, but in actuality it was not.
Speaker 3:I mean like you said justice was, the justice was definitely a challenge wherever you have people that are running it and managing it and, in our country, the racial disparity. You can't ignore it. You just, you just can't. And so it was hard not to be glad just that one of our guys avoided jail finally. That has been rigged against us for so long. What'd you say, keith?
Speaker 4:I would say you gotta also remember. Have you guys really watched the Rodney King beating, Beating?
Speaker 1:I mean that was before cell phone.
Speaker 4:This was before cell phone. One man with a camera watching four officers go to town Whipped his tail. Whipped his tail. All four of them got off All four In the same geographical area his tail all four of them got off, all four in the same geographical area of Southern California yes, it's in the same area, so, naturally, yes, they're pissed, they're angry, so they said okay, so they burned down their own neighborhoods.
Speaker 1:So that was another thing. But like, if you, if they had voted guilty, if they had said guilty, did they know that California, that part of California, would have been on fire?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's still been an episode of a different world. It would still have been an episode of a different world, true.
Speaker 1:So that's why I think.
Speaker 2:There's an underlying, of course. Yes, what they did was heinous, but there's always just been always this underlying thing when it comes to black and white people that a lot of people tiptoe around, it's always just been I'm not even going to say a competition, but it's always been us versus them. Whatever it is, whether it been that court hearing, whether it be a basketball game, whatever it is, it's always hey, us versus them, them versus whatever it may be and guess what oh yeah, we got one. Whether it be in this court hearing, or whether it be on the football field, whether it be on the basketball team, whether it be in academics, whether it be in whatever, it's always something underlining about us versus them. Whether it be on our part or whether it be on their part, it's always that underlining tension of we're not on the same team as a human race. It's always us versus them.
Speaker 3:I would say that's by demonic design, in actuality, the notion of black we got three different shades right here, and what is black? And then the notion of white. White and black are social constructs. When you look at science, we're all one and the same pretty much, and it doesn't really matter what the externals look like, but the social constructs almost like the what's, the Rwandan, the Hootsies.
Speaker 1:The Hootsie yeah.
Speaker 3:Tootsies, tootsie Roll. No, don't Tootsie Roll.
Speaker 1:No, don't say Tootsie Roll, we're not going to the Tootsies and the Hootus, I believe there we go. Why would you do that?
Speaker 2:But, like you just said, social construct, and I'll take it even a step, you know, I take it a step further. Think about people that are born blind. It's so weird to try to, to try to have them even think about color. They can't even like, they don't even understand. Like, what do you mean? The sea is blue? Huh, what is blue? Like? It's weird that when you are able to see, you kind of limit yourself with some of these things that you think are different, but for those who are blind, that were born blind, never, they don't even understand the concept of color, so it's silly to them.
Speaker 3:You know my question is Go ahead. No, you're good, I was about to go over something. How does Stevie Wonder know who's like what? If somebody Stevie Wonder they're really white, but he thinks they're Black, like I don't know.
Speaker 2:Now if you touch somebody's face, you can feel. You know the whole concept of the word black. It doesn't really, it's no way. Then you're talking about shades. It doesn't even. Again, it's very silly how we forget how the same we are even though we are different, but we keep the things that are limiting to us to put us down. We keep focusing on that instead of just thinking about hey, you know, at the end of the day, two people lost their lives because of emotions were running high, because somebody wasn't able to manage their emotions. And again, that's where it falls back on. Somebody was not able to manage their emotions and let anger get the best of them. And guess what? That's where it falls back on. Somebody was not able to manage their emotions and let anger get the best of them. And guess what? Now I'm willing to kill because I'm not even thinking. Let's just well. He wrote in his book right?
Speaker 2:If I did let's just say if he did, let's go on to another parallel. Since you know we're in comic book, into comic books, let's go to another parallel. Since you know we're in comic book, into comic books, let's go to another parallel universe to where he says that he did it right. Think about that. I am very successful hollywood star, football star, got millions of dollars. I am so mad that this one person is having sex with somebody else that I am willing to so forsake everything that I've worked hard for and go ahead and kill this person, not in thinking like I can have any woman in the world, I'm OJ. I'm OJ.
Speaker 2:But again, when we mismanage our emotions and we let anger get there and I always tell couples hey, you continue to let your anger get the best of you it's only going to wind up two ways You're either going to be dead or in jail. Now, circling back to oj, I mean, it is what it is. Hey, if he did it. If he didn't do it, hey, he got off regardless. Right, but at the end of the day, I wonder what that conversation is like. Is is like at the, at those pearly gates. I wonder what that conversation is like.
Speaker 1:So, I'm glad that you made that transition, because this was a question that I had for us.
Speaker 2:Given what yeah.
Speaker 1:No, no, I put it up there. I said is there any scenario where it's okay for a man to hit a woman?
Speaker 3:Absolutely yes.
Speaker 1:I need to take this down because we need to see the full screen version of you. All right, you said yes. What is that scenario?
Speaker 2:He didn't even pause, he let you know.
Speaker 1:What is that scenario?
Speaker 3:If there is any person who is on the verge of inflicting major harm on other human beings, like major harm, like they need to be stopped Malcolm X style, by any means necessary. And I would circle my comments back to say that when at all possible. I do believe that, men, because we are stronger physically, that we need to steward that strength well. And just because well, I'll say as a principal because a kid talks in class doesn't mean he's going to get expelled from school. So I'm not condoning at all, Like somebody called you outside of the name and you clock her over the head. But like, say, for instance, if somebody walked into a place with a weapon and they were getting ready to use that weapon to inflict harm, like whatever you got to do, and so um, but see.
Speaker 2:Here's the thing, though. With with that, why is it that we think about should? Is there any instance where a man should ever hit a woman? But if a woman hits a police officer, guess what's going to happen? No discrimination whatsoever. She's going to get her not her block knocked off regardless. And we're not talking about oh well, he shouldn't have did that, he should.
Speaker 2:The law is if you strike a police officer, any other force that comes after that is on you. So at that point in time and I guess this is kind of dear to my heart I went to a club with my girl's sisters having a birthday party or whatnot, and of course, I see a woman striking another woman, just going to try to hit at her, just because of some nonsense stuff. People are so, whether it's a man or a woman, they're so quick to put their hands on somebody. Not think about the consequences of your actions. If you put your hands on somebody, what is it the law of the universe? If you put your hands on somebody, what is it the law of the universe? Every action has an opposite react.
Speaker 4:Point blank.
Speaker 2:The universe don't care about. Oh, this person, you're a man or you're a woman? No, the opposite reactions. Well, you know how it go. So I don't understand. Why is it that we feel like a certain people should get a pass with certain things? Now, if a woman slap you, you just haul off and you know, close fisted, that's OK. Ok, Now we're talking about the severity. Ok.
Speaker 3:So, Steve, are you saying like like a pimp slap might be more appropriate, like they clarify. I'm curious.
Speaker 2:Here's the thing. I'm not saying any. You put yourself as the person that is putting your hands, anybody, man or woman. You put yourself in a position to now not be in control of your environment and those around you by striking an individual. By striking an individual, you put yourself in a predicament to where, hey, I could do whatever I want to do, because, at the end of the day, hey, whatever, if I'm a man and I hit another woman, guess what I'll do it and I'll just suffer the consequences. Whatever it may be right, but as a woman, you put yourself in the situation, and as a man, you put yourself in a situation that, hey, if you strike this woman, she's going to hit you back, or some other people are going to hit you back, or even, in this situation, what was that? Friday, this girl was hitting this other girl. Guess what?
Speaker 1:Everybody jumped up not just women, men too because they weren't playing Right.
Speaker 2:So again you put yourself in a situation If you put your hands on anybody and the sad thing about it is a lot of people right now they're not. They're not hitting back, they shooting back. So again you put yourself in a situation that now you have no control over. And again, where does this all stem from? Not being able to handle and manage your emotions.
Speaker 1:So, as a man, as a man, if you get hit by a woman, you are you saying that it's okay to return that same level? Or, as a man, are we supposed to utilize reason?
Speaker 4:no, we're not supposed to walk away. We need to allow them to know that I have. I have daughters and a son and I let my daughters know if you hit anybody, I don't care who it is, expect to be hit back. I don't care who it is, I don't care how hard you hit them. If you put your hands on somebody, expect whether they do it or not, whether they do it or not, whether they do it or not expect them to hit you back because you've opened that door. You don't know what the next person is doing in their I mean or thinking in their mind. You don't know what they're going to do.
Speaker 4:So if you decide that you're going to put your hands on somebody, expect them to come back and pop you as hard as they can, even if they do it to each other. I was like my daughter hit my son. He didn't hit her as hard as he could have, but he hit her back in a way that let her know I'm not playing, stop. And she did. And I'm like don't hit your sister. He's like but I told her to stop and he did.
Speaker 1:But you told her not to hit his sister. Why?
Speaker 4:Because I know that it will become easy. For some people it does. Once you open the door it becomes easy. That's how a lot of people can just backhand and beat the snot out of women and they don't blink twice because they do it often. But for those who don't do it often, you don't want to start down that path because it becomes easy. It is our superstructure. We can physically manipulate this situation and sometimes that's not what we need. Sometimes, like you said, the escalation is the key. But I do feel that if, if, if it's like Danny said, if it's a situation where it's it's volatile and somebody is going to get seriously hurt, then you've got to make Split decisions sometimes have to be made and sometimes you've got to make people go night-night. Now what if?
Speaker 1:you're walking away, you use the de-escalation tool. You're walking away, you're putting distance, but like a boxer, you know, if they tell the smaller boxers you need to get inside, get inside their reach, and they do what?
Speaker 4:if they get inside your reach, they will, they will get in your face and they will try to tell you and I don't condone it, and some of them will do it on purpose- yes and prevent you from leaving the room, strike first and strike often and again.
Speaker 4:You're expected to restrain and say, oh baby, don't do that. But no, if what do you mean? Don't restrain? As Steve said, what happens if you hit a police officer? What happens if you hit a grown man in the street? What happens if you punch Mike Tyson in the face? There's consequences. There's consequences Whenever you get ready to hit a man. You should think there's probably going to be some type of consequence. He loves me, but he's probably going to knock my block off, even if he doesn't, because a lot of women do it, because they know or they assume he's not going to do anything there you go.
Speaker 2:Because that same woman wouldn't go slap a lion exactly one of my friends told me this.
Speaker 3:He said that if she thought you were actually gonna hit her, back.
Speaker 2:Oh my god, yes, yes, that part. I know what you're about to say, that part, and he ain't said it. But that part, if I know what you're about to say.
Speaker 3:That part he ain't said it, but that part. If she thought that you were going to, she would never have put her hand on you.
Speaker 2:That's what gets good moves from bad rap, because if we didn't there, you go, they know.
Speaker 3:I'm going to ask y'all no show of hands. Any of y'all been hit by a woman before?
Speaker 1:I mean, what was that? Kindergarten, first grade, second grade?
Speaker 2:So, I have Last relationship. Yeah, what you mean? Third grade? No, let's be real.
Speaker 3:Let's keep it 100. Let's keep it 100.
Speaker 4:Because it's the arm table right If it's the arm table. It's the arm table. Sometimes it's believed that he won't respond back or he's not going to do anything, or sometimes they're like bring it. But then if we really brought it, that's what they quickly figure out. He hit me.
Speaker 3:He hit me and they surprised.
Speaker 4:And I almost met Jesus. Not him, not him, he would never no.
Speaker 1:So then, I guess the real question is what do good guys who do not resort to immediate equal energy do?
Speaker 3:in order to.
Speaker 1:I'm not allowed to.
Speaker 2:Chapter three in my book leave, that's. That's what you do. You leave because you don't know. When you leave, like okay, let's just say a situation where you have a volatile relationship, where if your woman feels as if it's okay for her to put her hands on you, she is now then bringing out the, she's trying to bring out the worst in you. At that point, absolutely On purpose, you need to leave because she has the potential to not be your Delilah and she's going to ruin your life.
Speaker 3:She will be your Delilah. There you go, she's simply trying to get you to react, because once she gets you to react, she's won.
Speaker 2:You're done. You're going to jail. Yes, she's one, you're done.
Speaker 4:You're going to jail. Yes, you're going to be dead.
Speaker 1:With all that considered, what if you know that she has been through some traumatic experiences?
Speaker 3:and that is her.
Speaker 1:That's what. Okay, never mind, I don't even want you to repeat that.
Speaker 2:That's a good point. It's also understanding, knowing what you're getting into and what you're. What is that, that one? What does it say? The, the, the, the girlfriend, matrix, what that dude said? Thinking about how much crazy you're willing to put up with, because if you, you, you got to know yourself.
Speaker 2:At this point it's like, okay, if a woman put their hands on me, I'm not going to be able to hold back, I'm going to haul off and I'm going to hurt her.
Speaker 2:So therefore, any signs of red flags that that's going to happen, if she gets up in my face in this and I'm saying this because I wish I would have told myself this years ago to save myself headache but understanding I would have left because I know all of this is going me. Not doing anything is not going to me. Not putting my hands on her is a double edged sword. Not only, yes, I don't hurt her, but then I hurt the dynamics of still of this relationship, because now she thinks it's OK to do these things and there's no consequences and I can just put all of my emotions out on him physically and he's not going to do anything. But then if I say, man, I do something, Guess what I not going to do anything, but then if I say amen, if I do something, guess what? I'm going to jail. Therefore, as men, as good men, what we need to do is be more emotionally aware of ourselves, to know it's okay to leave a volatile situation.
Speaker 1:You have to. Oh, so you're just going to leave me. Isn't that the trigger for men to say?
Speaker 4:you know what? There's no talking at this point because this is about you and God. At this point, you try to keep your freedom in your life and you're trying to spare hers too, so you need to go.
Speaker 2:Yes, and you know how we get out of pocket with it too. It's because when that happens and then you know, like every relation, that has its loops as far as stuff, but this happens, this big big argument happens, the fight happens, x, y, z, things then calm down a little bit. Guess what? We have sex, and sex is like the like, the, almost the master reset to make us think that everything is okay. Hey look, I had, as a man, when we get sex from a woman, guess what? Okay, cool, I'm relaxed, I got this aggression out. When she has sex with her, okay, guess what we cool, everything is okay. I was able to calm him down. No consequence, right? So sex kind of also clouds the mind of being able to understand this, ain't cool. We need to sever this, because if you feel that this this goes for women too if anybody feels that the other person is okay with putting their hand on you, that's not love not at all, and I don't care what type of trauma that you don't have this, that and the third.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, when you get done dealing with that trauma, come see about me if I'm still available, because somebody's gonna hurt, somebody's gonna get hurt and the best apology is change behavior.
Speaker 3:It's not, I'm so sorry, um, because, uh, we, we, we get into this and then it's men and women. You know, baby, I'm so sorry, I don't know. No, no, no, you need to go and get help, because the next time that you know what happens, like I mean, there has to be a very, very clear, definitive, hard line stance, because once you cross that boundary, you just open up the floodgate, pandora's box and keith. I think your perspective is so unique and that's this why I respect the scenario so much, because you worked with men in prison for like a decade. Like you, you've seen this play out over and over and over and over and over and over again, and you know that, like, not every one of those guys behind bars is a bad dude. A lot of times they were trying to leave steve.
Speaker 4:They was trying to get out broken leg from jumping off the balcony trying to get out. They got him with a broken leg from jumping off the balcony trying to get away. They brought him back. They brought him back with his broken leg and I said what you doing back? And he's like, listen, listen, listen. And then he broke down the whole story. I was trying to get out. She blocked the front door. I went to another one and she blocked that one, so she didn't think I would jump off the balcony so I ran out. There Two stories.
Speaker 3:I think another valid point, though I'm going to say this and I'm going to shut up because, steve, you were talking about leave, and I think there's two meanings of leave. One is physically, but I don't think we have enough conversations. I got people in my family who were in situations like that, where the woman had crossed that boundary and it's just like, okay, you, you still there. All right, it's if you're working towards a different resolution, actively working towards separation, so that there's going to be a very serious. It's not sustainable, because it's like, when I'm going to use this example and I'm going to shut up, it's like back in the day before we was going all the way, we was messing around, heavy petting, whatever you want to call it.
Speaker 3:Once you open up Pandora's box. That bad boy opened now and it ain't no going back. You're not putting toothpaste back in the tube, and so when it comes to the volatile nature, once that's open it very rarely corrects itself, and I think that sometimes it is appropriate, even if it's a temporary departure, to actually leave so that the other person can know that this is actually serious, and I'm not. We can't do this because it's not going to end well going to end well.
Speaker 1:But let me ask you this, okay, so even in that scenario, as Christian men who have been raised in the church or with um, at least with a heavenly minded morality, you know, I say you don't leave, you, don't you? You try to work it out. Where is that point that you that it's because everyone else they're going to say, hey, man, did you pray about it, did you? You know you got to give it to me.
Speaker 4:I was leaping out the door. I prayed when I got to my door.
Speaker 3:I prayed that God didn't bring me down the way down.
Speaker 4:The way down, I prayed to God like yeah, no. Down, I prayed to God like yeah, no, that's Christian. Listen, listen, how many men get caught up in? Because I'm thinking about the situation in total. Because, again, if you've ever gotten a call from an auntie, a sister, a cousin I mean an auntie, a sister or a niece this guy just put his hands on me, you brought over there ready to kill this man, to find out she started it and she was the whole mess.
Speaker 2:So listen to me.
Speaker 1:Why did you bring me into this?
Speaker 2:Oh my God, Keith, right there, right there, right?
Speaker 4:So my issue is this is bigger. This is bigger than just leaving, because you, if you don't leave, this again there's a whole mess that's waiting for you If you don't yes yes yeah, this is a great discussion, though, because we don't talk about this like I, I don't think I've yeah, we just don't talk about it.
Speaker 3:But a lot of guys deal with it and they don't know what to do. Um, and you naturally, especially if you're in a committed relationship, you're not going to flush it down the toilet right away, but you must take action and, like, what I like to reference is you know, when? God? Did God love Adam and Eve? Absolutely, he loved them, but there was this thing called a boundary, where, after they, they crossed the line, after they did what they should not have done. It's like, yeah, I love you to the point where it's going to cost me everything, it'll cost my life, but that old way, no, no, no, we're not doing that, no more. This is the first mention of a sword in the Bible where God's like boundary, like you, Okay, come back here.
Speaker 3:Even with the prodigal son. The prodigal son was like you know what? And the dad ultimately, was just like you know what I'm in. The dad Ultimately it was just like that Deuces. We can't fight for people who are not willing to change. We can't. We have to act. We have to respect their personal agency, and what I would do as a principal is I literally would sit down with people as they're getting're getting expelled, like I. Thank you for letting me know that you would like to go to another school. I'm going to respect that decision and give you this certificate of so so that you can go, because you know we don't do that here. We have to have boundaries or we have chaos.
Speaker 2:We have disorder.
Speaker 3:We have disarray which says the free and up their future. We have disorder. We have disarray which is free enough.
Speaker 2:The future.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we have to. And when it comes to relationships, I know ain't nobody been in a relationship where things can get tense? But you've got to have boundaries and when the boundary is crossed you have to erect with the help of good therapists like yourselves and good, knowledgeable friends. We have to be able to prevent those situations from becoming our normal, because when they become normal, they always escalate and it just doesn't end well.
Speaker 2:Oh, and with that, though, here's the thing you know, for those who have been in volatile situations, we can always look back and see. Before that volatile situation, there was always red flags that we ignored. So it didn't have to get this bad. We could have turned tail when we saw like, oh, and see here, the thing about it is thinking about your relationship that you're in now and the person that you with. I can just say hey, with my girl. I know just how her personality is. She's not about to put her hands on me at all. So, guess what? I'm making sure that I regulate my emotions because I don't want her to feel a certain way about me and I love her that much.
Speaker 2:Thinking about past situations, it's like, oh, okay, I could see that you can almost switch, you can turn that off like almost a pit bull, and you know, once a pit bull turns, it's once it locks on to you. There is no turning back for that. So at a certain point in time, we have to start looking at these red flags early, because, a lot of times, because we get caught up in our feelings and I like this person and the sex and all this stuff feelings, and I like this person and the sex and all this stuff. We ignore red flags, and red flags come back to bite us in the butt. How do we get here what you mean? The science was right there.
Speaker 3:We got here by tolerating foolishness and then all of a sudden, it blew up in our face. Then we got to have the tough conversations that we should have had a long time ago, and that's why it's good for us to have these conversations. So, brian, I appreciate you for bringing it. Maybe we're being too real, but I don't think that.
Speaker 2:No, this needs to happen.
Speaker 1:We just got to make this a part two. It's going to have to be part one because it's late and you know, I got to, got to help put the little guy down for the night. He's got school in the morning. I got to be at work at six in the morning. So, clothing thoughts, I'll let y'all close it so I can get the cue up the outro. But again, I do have to say that we don't own the rights to any music, that we don't own the rights to any music. Anything we use during this segment. We're just honoring the craft of musicians and only use it to honor what they do. Pretty soon we'll be doing our own stuff, so we don't have to honor nobody. But we'll work on that. But yeah, closing thoughts. I'll let y'all go around, just chime in in whoever the first person is. You know the last person probably be keith I just said keep your hands to yourself.
Speaker 3:That was it I'm done.
Speaker 2:Go ahead, steve I would say do unto others as you will want done to you. If you do something to somebody else, man or woman, don't be surprised if it's done back to you.
Speaker 1:Deacon Jones.
Speaker 4:There's a time for everything under the sun. Sometimes they like to be hit, oh Jesus.
Speaker 3:He just All right.
Speaker 1:All right.
Speaker 3:That right there. Y'all not finished today. Man, Come right. I'm logging off.
Speaker 2:Y'all not fair to me. Y'all can't. Y'all done talked to somebody. That's what I think Y'all done talked to somebody. Y'all done hit somebody.
Speaker 4:There's a time to Listen, there's a time for everything under the sun, like you said, but otherwise, keep your hands to yourself and love each other. Beating each other up is not love. It's not, it's chaos, it's toxic, that's all.
Speaker 1:I got.
Speaker 4:OJ was not black.
Speaker 2:You just broke some brains on that one. You said that sometimes they like to be beat.
Speaker 4:You just broke some brains. I'm listening, I'm trying to tell you.
Speaker 1:All right, fellas, fellas, man, it's been real well. It's closing time. We are glad you stayed with us this long. The bill oh, we tore that up, for truth and accountability are free. You want to leave a tip? Sure, we take your money. But what's even better is if you share this with someone you know. But there's always room for more at the Iron Table.